matej Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 anyone can please verify if the b18c1 rebuild kit will fit my b18c4? The piston bore is the same and b18c1 is basically an us equivalent to b18c4 so I hope the pumps, gaskets and bearings should fit but need to be sure before orderinghttp://www.ebay.com/itm/96-01-HONDA-ACU ... 19d74069d4'rebuild my mb6 or not and get an ep3' (very pricey here though compared to uk) ?PLEASE PLEASE I know my posts are always too long but I need an advice here badly about the 'rebuild my mb6 or get a ep3' that's really bugging me…since I don't post much often it is a lot of going in my head since I try to do a lot of research on my own and that just usually raises more questions lol…..I am an IT guy having cars just as hobby and although liking a lot the technical stuff about cars and knowing much more than a usual person who likes to call himself a 'car guy' I still have no real mechanical knowledge apart from reading a lot of theory….well I did few smaller jobs on my car like rear bearings and I actually disassembled my whole crashed vti with my friend and sold it for parts but since I live in city and have no house with a place where I could work on my car I didn't do much of DIY on my car...My car broke down about 2-3 weeks ago…..I knew my engine had some issues lately...leaking/consuming oil even more than before , my old car did too, but not as much as it was lately with this one, some strange dieselish noise sometimes when cold (valves?), some rattling around 3-4k revs that my old car also did and Honda never found out why and also lately excessive exhaust smoke when cold start and also as my friend told me some smoke at high rpms during some highway trip with him in his late 964 3.6L carrera 4….my dad always used to service his hondas at a official dealer and the care was always a bit clinical and not giving the car as much care as I would like….although the guy we always were dealing with was a fair and reasonable guy (the only one there) and we had sort of more family relations compared to other customers….they even did some small jobs for me free and I always could drive the car to the garage myself and talk directly to the mechanic about issues I had….surely they changed what the service manual says but they weren't completely successful at finding out some small issues with the car and lot of their responses were it's not that bad wait until you change this or that….my old car was in a good shape after 150k and regular honda service but the second one I bought was prolly a weekend racer driven hard and not that great as it lookedThe official garage cost a lot for work and the bill for an engine rebuild at them would be astronomical high just for the work itself plus considering all OEM parts for full price….so I was kinda thinking of dumping the car cheap and getting an ep3 type-r as that seemed the most logical next car from honda…..wouldn't sell it for more than 1500-2000 if it was running, maybe 2500 if it was in really good shape, so selling it for parts for 500-1000 wouldn't be such a big loss…definitely smaller than repairing it at honda dealer and selling after 2-3 yearsThe problem is I never really loved the ep3 looks…didn't like the 5d at all and even the type-r didn't look right to me….surely it has grown on me as I were reading more about them as I was thinking about what car to get next if my car dies and seeing many nice ones out there on the forums, but it never was a love at first like the dc2 or s2k that I still love to bits….also there are many compromises on the edm ep3 that kinda bug me although the real effect might not be as big as I might think like the mcstrut front susp and no lsd but still feels like a step back that I would probably want to sort out to be happy (meaning the lsd). Also they are not that much faster in stock form than the mb6 and they might be way too stiff for DDing on our crappy roads….although I was planning to get slips 16x7 with beefy 225/50 tires I am still not sure it would sort it out…I have found a very neat looking one….2004 NHBP with just 35.000 miles, first owner, bought new locally , full honda service history and looking almost totally stock (which is a good thing), but the price is crazy high compared to the UK prices...asking almost 7900GBP for it…..it is actually quite a good deal compared to other ep3s here though since I can only get a 60k-ish miles 2003 with shabby history (imported from CH, 3rd owner here) for 7 grand….seeing how the prices of them have dropped in UK in the last year I know the same will happen in a year or two here as I've seen the same happen kinda recently with mb6 prices following the UK massive value drop trend like 3 years agoI know I might be losing my last chance to get a very low mileage one, but it just seems too much to pay for a car that I actually don't really love just kinda started to like because it seems like the only honda option I have with my budget when not wanting to go down on power…I have about 9k and s2k that I love are still not cheap enough to get me a nice clean lower mileage one…and dc2s are kinda overpiced here and very hard to find not crap tuned one with low mileage since EU tuning is way way worse than the uk modding scene that actually has many nicely modded cars….disgusting spoilers is what you usually get here…there are few guys that mod their cars the right way but that usually ends up being a trackday car not much suited for daily commuting to work and back stuck in a car jam often and on our super bad roads with racing suspensionsI hate the facelifted ep3 looks that are easier to find with a low mileage even more since I was always more of a sleeper car guy and loved it about mb6….the clear taillights look too ricey where the old one looks nice, the headlight make the car look just dull (the prefacelifted looked at least kinda agressive), that huge H emblem looks just stupid on the facelift grill and I hate red interiors which all facelifted ones have….I know all those bits can be easily swapped for older parts to make it look better for me and definitely better to get a facelift with the suspension upgrades that are said to address the understeering issues and which can be found with lower mileage and try to find someone to swap the parts with me….I know I would prolly start loving it anyway for other reasons than looks but still it just seems like too much hassle for too much money and a really bad investment considering the current value drop in UK soon to be followed here with kinda not that much of an improvement in what I look for in a car….the mb6 is kinda perfect car for me in terms of power and comfort (or our roads I should say…I wouldn't mind bigger wheels and stiffer susp if I lived in switzerland)....I bought my second mb6 lowered 40mm and with 16inch 225/40/16 and 205/45/16 and it was just unbearable on our roads….with the drop and stock 195/55/15 alloys it was bearable but still not good enough….in the end I couldn't justify the few tenths of seconds in bends to constant 20mph slowdowns due to bad roads and went to completely stock susp setup (I had the parts from my crashed mb6....wasn't my fault and lost a lot of money on it since the insurance company of that bitch who crashed me claimed it as totalled and because of high mileage only gave me 1/4 of what the repair would cost and what was also the price of the second mb6 I got from germany….bough it with 40-ish k miles on it and now at 80-ish it broke down badly it seems…even after purchasing the gearbox looked in a bit worse shape than my old 150k miles mb6 that I got after my dad who got it new and was in a good shape overall…this car had the first gear problems like my old car but even worse, also it started leaking oil from camshaft ends and maybe under head and maybe even oil pan (well my old car did as well but prolly not as bad as this one got to lately) and since it was making the smoke I guess piston rings were bad.…I started hearing some short-time rattling at around 3k, 3.5k, 4k especially audible in third , little in second an later it actually started to do that in first as well and was loud as hell in first….well it didn't sound like anything internal more like some heatshiled/cover rattling noise….remember I had to remove cat cover for rattling, not sure on which car though…disadvantage of owning two same cars and having a bad memory I guess…also some bearing in gearbox was getting noisy but since the noise stopped when the clutch was pressed to floor it might just be the clutch release bearing and not the gearbox shaft bearing which would be harder job to replace and thus more expensive to repairWell I guess those problems kinda escalated over time due to lack of care from my dealer during regular maintenance services and partly due to my fear of the bill and not knowing any good unofficial garages to get the car sorted. When I was driving my car not far from home I was in second or third driving very very slowly in town between other cars and getting to a town speed from a red light when I heard a loud sound which sounded like something has fallen off my car and I was dragging it on concrete….that sound stopped after 1-2 seconds….I stopped after a few meters where I wasn't blocking the road completely and went to have a look if I lost something…didn't find anything on the road from where the noise started and didn't see anything hanging from the car either….I went back to car and started, took off and everything seemed normal.…I went to find a better quieter spot off the main road to have a closer look….drove slowly about one mile until I could find a free street with high curb so I could drive on it with half of car and look under….pretty much immediately as I stopped I saw some oil spilled under car and a lot of oil on the plastic engine undertray cover….since I was about to change oil I had unopened a 5L canister of magnatec in my trunk so I put like 1-2 litres in the car and drove slowly home….my car was not showing anything unusual everything felt just as before…..I was only about 2 miles from my home so I found some spot where a tow car could easily get to me and parked it….I went home for some canisters to catch the leaking oil but the next day when I was looking at it with my friend there was almost no oil in the bowls I put under where I could see it dripping down from under the car….when looking at the engine bay I have found there is actually a pool of fresh clean oil on the intake manifold so I wonder what happened….didn't hear any bang and wasn't flooring it so I guess it's not blown head gasket….might be just the oil pump exploding but when I looked at the dipstick there was no oil at all but at the same time there was no oil under the car…I was adding about a litre of oil every month or two and just very few times got very low on oil…no warning light never came on even when the oil was lower than the min mark....lately I was buying 5L canister for an oil change and 5x1L just for fill ups...Sorry about me braggin with this 'ep3 or rebuild mb6' thing but I am truly torn about what to do….I went in search for a list of parts needed to rebuild my mb6 engine and I thought I might up the power a bit by changing the parts for something better when doing it already and knowing there is some potential in there…..with more researching the more parts were coming on the list and I ended up with a list of parts and some estimates of work needed of almost 7k shipped and cleared (those from us, from uk it is tax/duty free since it is within eu but not as cheap)…now I fear I might end up spending crazy money once I start the rebuild and find out what all is badI guess I took it kinda extreme and made a list of all the moving parts in my engine lol....but you know how it is when you start reading those b18c4 to type-r threads and also finding out all that I feel might need replacing on my car sooner or later and extending it to what would be wise to do at the same time to get some more power when already getting something related alreadyThis is the excel spreadsheet published on google docshttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub ... utput=htmlOr you can dl the xlsx 2007 excel file directlyhttp://speedy.sh/sEXdC/MB6-rebuild.xlsxWell maybe it's just lack of knowledge and pesimism and maybe all it would need to get it running again is that rebuild kit I posted on top and a new clutch since I think it's actually the clutch release baring….and later get the new brakes….so that would be about 1000gbp and I would happily invest that in my mb6 to have it running again…I was reading the CTR buying guide on CTRO and read that noisy tappeting sound can be fixed just by doing the valve clearances job whatever it means….I thought I would have to have them replaced so maybe it isn't as bad as I feared…most of the issues were smaller problems and parts not costing much to buy but costing a lot to have it replaced by a garage (if not a cheap one)Can someone please give me some advice on the rebuild estimate cost….I will happily provide any more info you need if you've read my long thread and want to help a fellow long devoted honda fan that's having a hard time deciding what to doI always considered the ep3 to be one of my possible future cars but now that I am really finding more and more about it and it is getting closer I am not really that sure I would be that happy with it….I have some money (about 9k) from a saving fund my dad kept paying for me when I was younger and I was telling my dad that I will buy an s2k for the money when they drop in price and I had a better wage to add something and afford one.….I know the ep3s are great supercharged and can be fast even with just boltons and retune and probably faster than s2ks both real world and track and more practical but I am not sure I would be satisfied with it stock and to make the ep3 as fast as I would like it to be (ie noticeably faster car than mb6) is hard without making it probably crazy loud and I would feel really embarassed to have a still kinda slow car with loud exhaust…and at the price that I can get them here it is getting close to probably better cars especially when counting in all the stuff I would need done to like the car….so I am still considering repairing my mb6 and waiting until I have more money and budget for other options to choose from but if getting the mb6 back to shape would cost me most of the money I have now it kinda loses it's meaningthx to anyone who can find the time to read it and help me out here ;o]]cheers matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S4DAM Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 wow. longest post ive read i think... and ive printed the spreadsheet out and had a skimimo now im no mechanic - im just full of bright ideas , why dont you try and find a used engine b18 with gearbox will save alot of hassle and shouldnt cost you more than 1200 GBP or less even including fitting, if you find a teg thats been running sweet then find a good honda specialist near where you are and get them to do the swap... that will get you back on the road at least. meanwhile if you're happy with the way it is keep that setup or continue with your planned overhaul on the engine/gearbox thats been taken out, gives you the freedom of getting around and not having to waiting on months for parts/time to complete the projectAs for the overhaul, i think going to all that hassle, everyone almost ends up exceeding their budget as you find yourself stuck for some parts that are just extortionate that you can't find a way around to get any cheaper. Just depends how badly you want it? even buy another mb6, thats working right, you can easily pick one up in the UK with great spec around £1500anyway hope that doesnt confuse you further Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matej Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 wow man thx a lot for reading my super long post and trying to help me out....I really appreciate it and there is a lot to think about about what you have said.....the overhaul looks like a long run job and I also have no other car in the meantime (lol I almost got lost yesterday when going to work by public transport since I had to return my sisters old car to her)....the main thing is Honda just doesn't offer anything I would be really temped to buy and although the mb6 was really perfect for me I don't see any reasonable alternatives out there with the honda badge and enough of the true honda spiritI never thought I would say that but I might be up for a car brand change.....as I've written in my looong post the EP3 I was considering was almost 8k which is huge money compared to uk prices and compared to what you can get from other car makers used....and seeing the massive price drops in UK of EP3s it seems like a really really bad investment to buy an ep3 for 8k no matter how low mileage it is....I would probably struggle to sell it for half that 2-3 years later when the trend now going on in uk comes to my countryI have actually found a beamer today (lol I know) for the same price as that ep3 and it just fits my needs of daily driver so much better that I might buy it....going to see it tomorrow...it's an 2006 black E90 sedan 325i 160kw with just 62tm and having the 60tm service done....compared to that ep3 it is just night and day....for a track car sure the ep3 would be my choice but for a 30 year old petrolhead it seems wiser in every way to get that beamer instead...it won't be too harsh for daily use, should give me enough thrill when I occasionally want to and the resell value will be double the ep3 in a few years....it is sure a sad day for me since after 3 hondas in a row (and 10 years of owning them) I'll have something else, but one should try everything and since the honda just doesn't offer anything for me I feel the right time to try something else is now....this surely isn't my last post here, if I get that car I will surely show it here in the 'where have you moved thread' and will always have a spot in my heart for the mighty M and hopefully one day I could come back to owning a honda again whether it be my dreamed s2k or something else that honda will come up with....I also have few hondas in my family, my sis has a FN2 and my dad has the latest 2.4L accord, but those are cars that I don't really look up to nowI just hope I can put the rest of the car to a good use and make someone as happy as the mb6 always made me....from my old crashed mb6 I sold the engine to a bloke who build it up so if I find someone with similar plans the engine after a rebuild could make someone happy stillI was actually very depressed by the situation and really was trying to find a honda I could buy but now that I finally had to open my mind to other marks I actually feel a strong relief and looking forward to seeing the car tomorrow....I hope I won't fall in your eyes too much for going german instead of jap car....it will surely be something very new for me too, but as I've said I'd rather try different mark when the situation calls for it and come back later than be unhappy about owning a honda that doesn't fit my needs well and actually lose my honda passion more than when just trying something elseI really loved the sharing and caring honda community and can only hope I will find at least half that love in the bmw community I might become a part ofI really wish all the best to you all and especially your cars and I hope you won't find yourself is such a situation I was in...luckilly I have some money to spend on a new car and not having to struggle trying to figure it out the hard waymuch love forever an M fan Matt (lol those last words almost brought me to tears...not kidding pals) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knight Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 That one crazy read! Epic Post award goes to matej Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matej Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 lol thx knight....hard to see your mint looking pirate black in the sig...I would love my pirate black mb6 to be like yours...hope she stays like that for a long time to come ;o]] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knight Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 lol thx knight....hard to see your mint looking pirate black in the sig...I would love my pirate black mb6 to be like yours...hope she stays like that for a long time to come ;o]]Thank mate,,,Pirates black is a lovely colour I've always dreamed on have a ep3 type r, if a had one it would be black or silver and be the premier edition Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matej Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 hope it didn't sound too snobbery than not wanting the ep3 but with the roads we have and the current prices for LHD ones the circumstances are just all against it now and I need a new car fast....and I never really dreamed about ep3 though (I've always dreamed about ap1, dc2 and na1) but I have respected them for what they are and loved seeing some great examples of their full potential...but that would just bug me more wanting more of it and not being able to because of lack of money for proper parts or bad roads here meaning no fancy suspensions...they would be a great track car but than you just can't use it for commuting here no matter how big of a petrolhead you think you are...but for a track car of course it would be cheaper to go for eg shell and just k-series powertrain if I didn't need it to be useable on the public roads as well....was thinking of using my old crashed mb6 powertrain and building myself gsr hatch back then, but again I did not have space for such projects and still don't to do it this time either...if I had the place for it I would rebuild the engine myself and put it in an eg...the mb6 bits like steering rack and brakes/hubs would make a great upgrade to the eg6 as well...I even have a book on how to rebuild the b-series by brooklands/car-tech (apart from service manuals and epc) ;o]so the chances are still there as for a track car I can't imagine ever wanting anything else than eg/dc2/na1 and I still don't have a second car convertible and could never go z4 over my all time love the s2k ;o] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matej Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 which one would you get for 8k as your daily driver and only car ;o]2004 EP3 Type-R 147kw, 196 Nm, 0-60 mph in 6.4inline 4, 2.0L, 6-speed manual35.000 miles, first owner bought locally7888 GBP2006 E90 325i 160kw, 250Nm, 0-60 mph in 7.0inline 6, 2.5L (not the detuned 3.0L), 6-speed manual62.000 miles, first owner bought locally8049 GBP these are the actual photos from ads....going to see the BMW tomorrow since they didn't manage to transport it from other city where it was to my city during today...think the beamer is much closer to the stock mb6 spirit (sort of quick practical car comfortable enough for daily use) which is what I need for my commuting here....can't afford to risk spending all my money on another low mileage car that has been trashed to hell and back on weekends and will have no resell value in 2-3 years (as was the case with my pirate black mb6 which I bought for like 6k pounds 4 years ago thinking it would serve me for another 50tm since it was just 40ish back then) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matej Posted January 5, 2013 Author Share Posted January 5, 2013 damn seems like I am back to step 0I've read about all 2005-2008 2.5L and 3.0L N52 engines having a bad design flaw causing the hydraulic valve lifters making a terrible clicking noise on cold starts...there are dozens of scary videos on youtube with cars sounding worse than a tracktor which I could never have lived with even if it was true that it doesn't affect the performance or causing premature wear which many do not believe....and the permanent fix seems to be a whole new cylinder head that they redesigned and is used on 2009 and newer engines....cost 7000 usd, the lifters cost 2000 usd which they seem to have redesigned as well and might fix the problem without changing the head in some cases....that said reading about the not very good reliability of new bmws and hearing the cost for repairs I guess I am not gonna have bmw anytime soon until I afford getting one covered by a warranty.....never thought it's so bad with new cars but it seems the eco crap rules are making the cars too complex and running on the edge these days....I though n/a 6 cylinder from a new bmw would be pretty reliable but seems I was wrong and there is a general opinion that running these modern complex engines without a warranty of some sort is a financial suicide and not a future proof investment as I thought at firstabout 100 pages from people having the HVL issues....http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13504lol seems like I am back to the mb6 rebuild or type-r decision....going to see the car today (to collect the returnable transport fee at least) but I am pretty much decided not to take it...seems like I've got used too much to the honda reliability and still I can't say it's cheap to run them but that is probably more of a expensive service thing than actually cars having too many problemsI have found some garage specializing in japanese cars and mainly hondas and it is not very far from where I work so I will get the car inspected there and try to get some professional quote about getting my car back to running...maybe I will find there someone who seems knowledgeable enough and clear some things up for methe bmw actually looked not much well looked after...totally bald tires, like not even 1mm of thread left and some cosmetic flaws like a small scratches on the front panel already showing some rust which noone taking a good care of his car would leave unrepaired to let it get worse....I am kinda disappointed but at the same time better safe than sorry...I at least know something about hondas and their reliability and common problems so I might stick to thatso back to my initial question...anyone know if the b18c1 rebuild kit is compatible with b18c4?I think I'll try to get my car running again and think a bit more about my next car...I don't really feel like rushing this decision and looking for a new car without the current one running is a real pitaalso I might put the engine to good use when I finally find a new car for me...I might swap the engine into eg and have some weekend blast toy since I won't make much money anyway selling the M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjis Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 Well, at least all the seals are the same, and the piston rings are the same, so basically yes, it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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